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Shimano or Campagnolo? That is the question

Discovery Channel pro Matt White gives us the low-down on the relative merits of Shimano and Campagnolo


Posted: 19 March 2007
by Matt Conn



Most recreational riders or amateur racers make their groupset decision based on any one of a number of reasons. Some of these are well founded, some are based around prejudiced cycling folk lore and sometimes the decision is based purely upon what their professional cycling heroes race on the international road circuit. Some professional cyclists might go their entire career riding on one manufacturer’s groupset. Others, through team and sponsor changes, will have had put both Shimano and Campagnolo to the test under the ultimate race conditions.

At the start of the 2006 Giro d’Italia, Australian Matt White gave his opinions on the two major manufacturers and their top of the line groupsets. After leaving Campagnolo-equipped Cofidis at the end of 2005, White returned to his Shimano-equipped former team, Discovery Channel (known as the United States Postal Service when he was there from 2001 to 2003) for the 2006 and 2007 seasons.

'The biggest thing I found was the lever shape. I’ve got quite small hands and I quite enjoyed riding with the Campag levers,' is how White described what he saw as the major difference between the two manufacturers. 'The Shimano levers feel at least a centimetre longer than the Campag ones and even from how they used to be before the change from nine to 10 speed.'

White was at USPS when Shimano introduced the 10 speed Dura-Ace groupset and it brought about the need for some mid-season alterations amongst the team. 'I found it a little bit harder when we changed from nine to 10 speed in the middle of the season because you are out a bit further. That’s why you find a lot of the guys do kick their handlebars up a little bit.' The Australian added.

'It depends on the position that you do ride on the bike, because with the Shimano levers you can hold them in a couple of different places. It depends on what’s right for you. With the Campag ones, I used to have them straight out and flat. They have the little hood on the end and that worked out well for me.'

So is that it? The only difference between the two major component manufacturers is the shape of their levers. Surely there has to be more to the Campagnolo – Shimano rivalry than that. When pressed, White did have one small gripe he remembered from his time at Cofidis, using the equipment of the Italian manufacturer. 'I remember that we had a problem with chains, but, to be honest, with Campag and Shimano I don’t find too much of a difference.'

Personal preference seems to be a significant, but often underplayed reason that people who pay for their own equipment choose one manufacturer over the other. Professional cyclists do not get to make a decision about the major components that they ride on their team bikes. Gone, however, are the days when riders were forced to ride inferior equipment to satisfy a commercial agreement negotiated by a team owner. Today, if the equipment doesn’t function well, the teams simply will not use it.

'When the equipment is kept in good condition and replaced regularly, like it is on our race bikes, we don’t have too many stuff ups from either groupset. I’m happy to ride both. White concluded.


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Did Matt get an RCUK jersey?
Posted: 19/03/2007 17:17

Interesting find Adam, thanks for sharing. Mind you, I don't suppose he would rubbish either current or potential sponsors so a small measure of diplomacy may be a factor here.
Posted: 19/03/2007 17:29

Talk about cynicism...
Posted: 19/03/2007 17:59

Didn't find it too fascinating if I'm honest, more of a 'campag is a different shape to Shimano'
Posted: 19/03/2007 18:23

Sorry I wasnt able to fascinate you Adam
:-(

Posted: 19/03/2007 19:26

;-)

If I'm honest again, there is not much difference between the groupsets, only the lever size, there's not too much to write about.
Posted: 19/03/2007 19:29

Why bother posting on this thread, then, Adam? Other than to express your own personal indifference.Here we have a pro giving his own personal appraisal of the two. You are right that there is little difference in function, i.e. they both work superbly. In design and engineering, they are very different.
Posted: 19/03/2007 19:46

Maybe thats the whole point.
We managed to generate page after page of "opinion" on the Forum about the two different manufacturers. It really boils down to what you like personally and what you have experience with.
Matt White has used both (paid for neither of course) and cannot find too much that puts one over the other.

Posted: 19/03/2007 20:24

Why bother posting on this thread, then, Adam? Other than to express your own personal indifference.Here we have a pro giving his own personal appraisal of the two. You are right that there is little difference in function, i.e. they both work superbly. In design and engineering, they are very different.

I don't quite follow, you pointed out the reason why I posted it, to point out that after 12 pages of banter, what it boils down to is they both work but work a little differently.

Was there something else?
Posted: 19/03/2007 20:46

the third way...SRAM...makes you go faster as the brakes will fail on you? Neither campag or the big S have that feature!
Posted: 19/03/2007 21:36

Sorry. It was supposed to be a wry reflection on the need to tell people of your indifference. BTW, the problem with the SRAM Force brakes concerned a washer, so outright failure seems an unlikely outcome.
Posted: 19/03/2007 22:02

Matt Conn - Jounalist - what's next!!!

Would love to know what other pro's would say if posed with the same question. No doubt there would be some differing opinions.

Was there something else? Yes Adam there was. We now know Matt White has small hands. ;-p
Posted: 19/03/2007 23:00

Matt White must have strange hands. I find 10sp much easier to reach than 9sp when on the drops. The hood is longer but the lever is nearer to the bars.
Posted: 19/03/2007 23:40

I find the hoods on DA10 good, I have them pointing up slightly and it's comfortable and you can get down quite low on the hoods.

But, if you've used Campag for ages? I guess it would feel comfortable too.
Posted: 20/03/2007 07:44

Has nobody but me noticed that Shimano STi levers, with their ungainly shape and swinging gear cable emerging from one side, are the most hideously ugly piece of cycling kit ever made? A well proportioned road bike can be a jewel of aesthetic delight, only a complete philistine would put those horrible things on it.

On second thoughts, perhaps the true connoisseur of elegant things cycling would ride a fixed wheel. :-)

Posted: 20/03/2007 12:44

I agree with Adam. The Shimano hoods are very comfy. If I had the will & means the perfect levers for me would be to intergrate Shimano hoods with Campag levers using the Campag thumb lever and hidden cables.
Posted: 20/03/2007 13:21

I have been "noticing" the way people have their Shimano levers set up.
Lance tended to have his in the "traditional" position, where more and more peopl (pro and amateur alike) have them sticking up in the air and their bars rolled right forward. Surely a shorter stemm would sort out the reach issues?
Is it because people were used to having their stem length "just so" and when they put the new 10speed levers on, decided to keep everything the same and just move the bars about until they could get their normal position?
Putting aside my Campag bias for a moment, to me the Shimano levers look silly when set up like that.
Anyone who has them care to comment?
Posted: 20/03/2007 14:31

Spot on Matt. I saw a guy recently ago with his levers set up this way and god knows how he managed to grab the levers when in the drops if he was wanting to brake. I think alot of people want the pro look and try to make themselves fit the bike rather than the other way around. Agree with them stem comment. I've shortened mine on my new bike to 90mm. Has made a big difference to my lower back.
Posted: 20/03/2007 15:16

Mine aren't too bad, I've seen guys who look like they've got six shooters.
Posted: 20/03/2007 15:21

In this picture Lance's levers look high especially when compared to Simeoni's. I thought it was this look that prompted many to use the high position, the same people would probably follow the high cadence method also, whether it worked for them or not.
Posted: 20/03/2007 15:36

My hoods:
http://www.fusionsites.co.uk/mymerlin.jpg

Too high?
Posted: 20/03/2007 16:03

If it's safe and comfortable then who cares?
Posted: 20/03/2007 16:10

nice bike adam but how do you manage to get it going without pedals?
Posted: 20/03/2007 16:51

Didn't get ridden for a few months, so never had to put pedals on it. ;-)
Posted: 20/03/2007 17:05

Nathan is right 'though. If they are rolled so far forward, how easy is it to brake from the drops?
Is it the modern cycling epidemic where we are all trying to get lower and lower to the point where our ideal position is now on the tops of the levers, rather than in the drops of the bars?

Posted: 20/03/2007 20:57

mine rides nicely on the drops and i find the shimano levers very comfy, i don't like the thumby things on campag
Posted: 20/03/2007 21:28

Not the thumb levers or campag vs shimano, but more a question of how having the levers set so they sit up in the air, allows you to brake from the drops?

Adam's Merlin looked ok....

Now it looks better.
Cranks: Fixed
Lever Cables: Fixed
Top tube: Correctly Nationalised
Photo Shop: Poor effort


Posted: 20/03/2007 21:58

I think someone has too much time on their hands!!!!!

Does look much better without the cables though.
Posted: 20/03/2007 22:13

Or due to the poor quality of the image editing, it could be argued that I dont have enough time!
Posted: 20/03/2007 22:46

Actually right, looks much better without cables.
Posted: 21/03/2007 07:05

Ergo(!), if it looks better without the cables, perhaps Cmpag is the answer.:-)
Posted: 21/03/2007 09:27

it looked better with your deep sections (or disk wheels as one guy referred to them in the race)on now you just need to update your bar tape.
Posted: 25/03/2007 19:09

Mike I noticed earlier in the thread you said you had put on a shorter stem, 9 cm, to combat lower back pain. Did it work?
Posted: 26/03/2007 13:52

Oh, actually it ws Nathan and he said it helped lots. How much shorter is 9 cm that your previous stem Nathan?
Posted: 26/03/2007 13:54

Martin, it definitely isn't me with the 9cm stem, I'm an old fogey who's built like a gorilla. This means a 13cm stem and down tube levers, except when I'm riding fixed (actually most of the time), then it's an ancient GB 531 14cm stem and no gear levers at all :-).

Ps. I believe Adam is a bit of a fixed wheel devotee too, at least when he's away from delicate company:-).
Posted: 26/03/2007 14:52

I had thought it was Mike Spence but it wasn't, it was Nathan.

BTW Mike I have taken the 13 cm Cinelli XA stem off my Italian bike and intend to sell it. It is perfect and unmarked, the latest type sold and suitable for 26.0 mm bars. Of which I also have a pair -- 46 cm Cinelli Solida, also perfect, and claimed to weigh less than 200 grammes. If you wanted to replace yours (and bars and stem do not have an unlimited service life!) you are welcome to make me an offer.
Posted: 26/03/2007 15:10

Yeah it was me. Also used shallow drop bars. The top tube on the new bike is longer than on my training bike but it also has a longer head tube so by shortening up the stem it has given me a more upright position which has taken the strain from the lower back. My back has been sh*t for years from bowling in cricket and had mild scoliosis as a kid. Stem on my training bike is 110mm. Have also found more power when climbing in the saddle - I'm still not a climber though.
Posted: 26/03/2007 16:42

Yes, the backache is less apparent on bikes with a longer head tube. I suppose it is mainly a question of how acute an angle the back forms. Trouble with this thinking is you end up concluding the answer is a recumbent.

Recumbents anyone?
Posted: 26/03/2007 16:55

Martin, thanks for the offer, but I have 2 spare Cinelli stems and 2 sets of bars 'in my box'. Mind you, in 45years I've never broken either bars or a stem, lots of cranks though!! and once a brake lever which broke off as I was 'honking' over the Burton flyover turn on the K16 25mile course, perhaps 58 x 13 was a bit on the big side!:-)

As i said, Gorilla.
Posted: 26/03/2007 18:34

I think the initial article could have covered more.

For example what was the difference between 9 and 10 speed, what about the two alternative lever styles, eg, thumb vs .., cable routing, is there any difference in actual performance changing up and down, what about skipping gears, changing front and back simultaneously, have they improved over the years, what are the performance and comfort differences between top of the range and bottom, compact range vs alternatives.

There is actually a lot that the pros could do to help us discern the small differences that lead to more informed choice.
Posted: 05/04/2007 02:59

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